Infinit or Nissan for GT-R_debate
08-09-2005, 10:07 AM
#21
Newbie
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 27
Bonzelite,
Yes, I guess I fit into the clueless, possible future buyer category.
I will care how the new GTR will compare with other sports cars in the current market place, not how it will compare with past GTRs. I know others will be comparing the new GTR with past versions. I do not look on these two philosophies as right or wrong, they just fit different types of people. However, Nissan has to take both into account in building the GTR. That is a task! If they do it, then as you say, it will pay dividends in not just the sales of the GTR, but for the rest of their product line.
Here's to a new, visually exciting GTR that is a blast to drive with a service and support network to match. So that after a drive you get out of the car, catch your breath, and say WOW.
We shall see.
Yes, I guess I fit into the clueless, possible future buyer category.
I will care how the new GTR will compare with other sports cars in the current market place, not how it will compare with past GTRs. I know others will be comparing the new GTR with past versions. I do not look on these two philosophies as right or wrong, they just fit different types of people. However, Nissan has to take both into account in building the GTR. That is a task! If they do it, then as you say, it will pay dividends in not just the sales of the GTR, but for the rest of their product line.
Here's to a new, visually exciting GTR that is a blast to drive with a service and support network to match. So that after a drive you get out of the car, catch your breath, and say WOW.
We shall see.
08-09-2005, 05:18 PM
#22
GTR Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 869
and i am more likely to buy it used, years from now (if i buy one at all), off of someone like you! (provided you buy it outright and not lease it)
currently, i have my sights on an R32 GT-R. i doubt the new GT-R will look cooler than the R32.
in ways, the comparison is unfair because the entire platform is different. and i see the merits across all of the gens, from the 1960s to present.
as you say, we shall see.
currently, i have my sights on an R32 GT-R. i doubt the new GT-R will look cooler than the R32.
in ways, the comparison is unfair because the entire platform is different. and i see the merits across all of the gens, from the 1960s to present.
as you say, we shall see.
08-10-2005, 08:50 AM
#23
Newbie
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 27
Bonzelite,
One of the reasons I buy new cars is I do not like to work on them (plus I would not be very good at it to boot). However, I think it would be cool to buy a used car and then modify it to suit one's desires. I think it would be a very satisfying experience.
Sounds like you fall into this category. Hope you find the R32 GT-R.
If I bought a new GTR, it would be a cash deal and I would probably keep it until it until it fell apart. But, I am sure there will be enough OFs that will buy the car and after a year or so find out it is not for them. Then the used market will be in full swing.
One of the reasons I buy new cars is I do not like to work on them (plus I would not be very good at it to boot). However, I think it would be cool to buy a used car and then modify it to suit one's desires. I think it would be a very satisfying experience.
Sounds like you fall into this category. Hope you find the R32 GT-R.
If I bought a new GTR, it would be a cash deal and I would probably keep it until it until it fell apart. But, I am sure there will be enough OFs that will buy the car and after a year or so find out it is not for them. Then the used market will be in full swing.
08-10-2005, 02:35 PM
#24
GTR Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 869
dragon, somewhat in accord with you, most of the time, i don't like to work on cars either, as it is not my trade. and i often must figure out how to do something from zero. and that can be a waste of my time. therefore, as i have aged, gotten a better income, have more obligations professionally, i just pay others to fix my cars.
fixing my own car has become a sort of luxury, if you can understand what i mean (for example, last weekend, i took apart my chain saw, cleaned it, lubed it, gave it a service job, and it was so relaxing. it made me want to go work on my car). yet there are lots of jobs that i would never want to do anyway, like dropping a transmission or changing out a rear-end. i would not even care to change the struts and shocks --a big pain and very dangerous.
car maintenance can be a hobby. it can be relaxing and fun, especially if friends come over and offer help. it has a social dimension. and of course the payoff is power. and prestige. and fun. and the modifications are never-ending. once you begin to mod the car, there is always something greener, better, to put into it. some people devote astronomical amounts of time and money to tuning. it becomes a way of life, literally. look at how huge the aftermarket industry has become.
i could buy a new car, but i do not. i retain the cash-only-for-a-car policy. and then figure out the problems with it once i get it. 60 or 80 grand for a new car, though, is beyond what i would every buy at this point. for that, i can get a used car, dirt cheap, and modify it for about 20 grand. and have a unique tuner car, custom fit to how i want it, and there is no car payment.
of course there is no substitute for the "new car" experience. you get the new car smell, the car was and is only yours, it has maybe ten miles on the odometer, it is under warranty; it is dazzling. and you "have it all."
fixing my own car has become a sort of luxury, if you can understand what i mean (for example, last weekend, i took apart my chain saw, cleaned it, lubed it, gave it a service job, and it was so relaxing. it made me want to go work on my car). yet there are lots of jobs that i would never want to do anyway, like dropping a transmission or changing out a rear-end. i would not even care to change the struts and shocks --a big pain and very dangerous.
car maintenance can be a hobby. it can be relaxing and fun, especially if friends come over and offer help. it has a social dimension. and of course the payoff is power. and prestige. and fun. and the modifications are never-ending. once you begin to mod the car, there is always something greener, better, to put into it. some people devote astronomical amounts of time and money to tuning. it becomes a way of life, literally. look at how huge the aftermarket industry has become.
i could buy a new car, but i do not. i retain the cash-only-for-a-car policy. and then figure out the problems with it once i get it. 60 or 80 grand for a new car, though, is beyond what i would every buy at this point. for that, i can get a used car, dirt cheap, and modify it for about 20 grand. and have a unique tuner car, custom fit to how i want it, and there is no car payment.
of course there is no substitute for the "new car" experience. you get the new car smell, the car was and is only yours, it has maybe ten miles on the odometer, it is under warranty; it is dazzling. and you "have it all."
08-11-2005, 09:53 AM
#25
Newbie
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 27
Bonzelite,
Not a bad plan, get that cheaper used car and get it modified to fit your use(for a hell of a lot less cost). I guess what keeps me from trying that, is finding a "good" tuner shop in my area to do the work.
While I do buy a car new, I do keep it for a long time (usually 8-10 years), so I try to find something that I like and will not tire of. I guess I may break that rule this time around. My G-35 coupe is only a year old, but if that GTR is really a winner, then the G-35 will be history in a few years.
I guess I am getting a little off topic, but what do you think about not buying the first year GTR, but waiting for the next year model. It seems these days that the first year model always has "teething" problems of some kind. For example, the first G-35(sedan and coupe) had some issues, but they were resolved in the next year's model.
I am a little concerned that with all the new technology on the new GTR, that there is a good possibility for some issues to occur. Look at the Ford GT, a $150,000 car and had(have) some major issues. Yes, I know FORD(Fix Or Repair Daily), but Mercedes Benz was having problems with their models because of isssues with the new technology they were using.
What is your take on this?
Not a bad plan, get that cheaper used car and get it modified to fit your use(for a hell of a lot less cost). I guess what keeps me from trying that, is finding a "good" tuner shop in my area to do the work.
While I do buy a car new, I do keep it for a long time (usually 8-10 years), so I try to find something that I like and will not tire of. I guess I may break that rule this time around. My G-35 coupe is only a year old, but if that GTR is really a winner, then the G-35 will be history in a few years.
I guess I am getting a little off topic, but what do you think about not buying the first year GTR, but waiting for the next year model. It seems these days that the first year model always has "teething" problems of some kind. For example, the first G-35(sedan and coupe) had some issues, but they were resolved in the next year's model.
I am a little concerned that with all the new technology on the new GTR, that there is a good possibility for some issues to occur. Look at the Ford GT, a $150,000 car and had(have) some major issues. Yes, I know FORD(Fix Or Repair Daily), but Mercedes Benz was having problems with their models because of isssues with the new technology they were using.
What is your take on this?
08-11-2005, 10:54 AM
#26
GTR Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 869
dragon, you raise a good point, actually, and is related to the topic: to buy the first production run of the GT-R, or wait. --were it me, i would wait.
a great example for a myriad of problems is the 350Z: that car, as much as i hate to say it, is basically a lemon. it's performance and styling notwithstanding, it is (or at least was) plagued by numerous little problems (like the windows not working, and when they did, would come back up with grease all over them from the internal mechanisms. or, worse, the infamous tire/ alignment problems) that made it a fantastic disappointment. the problems with that car are too numerous to list here. try this:
350Z Problems and Troubleshooting:
http://www.350zmotoring.com/forums/a...x.php/f-5.html
however, i am unaware of such mishaps for the G35. that seems to be a pretty solid car.
i'd still wait and let the first buyers have at it.
here is an interesting consumer reports article. it cites that there were far more problems with model year 2000 cars than in later years of the same model. year 2000 was when many auto makers introduced entirely new cars and body styles, ie, it was a "first year" of production for many cars:
http://autos.yahoo.com/consumerrepor...s_hold_up.html
a great example for a myriad of problems is the 350Z: that car, as much as i hate to say it, is basically a lemon. it's performance and styling notwithstanding, it is (or at least was) plagued by numerous little problems (like the windows not working, and when they did, would come back up with grease all over them from the internal mechanisms. or, worse, the infamous tire/ alignment problems) that made it a fantastic disappointment. the problems with that car are too numerous to list here. try this:
350Z Problems and Troubleshooting:
http://www.350zmotoring.com/forums/a...x.php/f-5.html
however, i am unaware of such mishaps for the G35. that seems to be a pretty solid car.
i'd still wait and let the first buyers have at it.
here is an interesting consumer reports article. it cites that there were far more problems with model year 2000 cars than in later years of the same model. year 2000 was when many auto makers introduced entirely new cars and body styles, ie, it was a "first year" of production for many cars:
http://autos.yahoo.com/consumerrepor...s_hold_up.html
08-14-2005, 12:17 PM
#27
Newbie
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 27
Bonzelite,
I am with you. Think I will use the TMS to see if the concept, that will hopefully be shown, is something that stirs my soul or not. If the information that comes out appeals to me then I will look to the 2008 model year to purchase one, assuming that any problems that turn up in the 2007 model can be easily fixed. If I am disappointed in the new GTR then I guess I would need to look at alternative cars.
I am with you. Think I will use the TMS to see if the concept, that will hopefully be shown, is something that stirs my soul or not. If the information that comes out appeals to me then I will look to the 2008 model year to purchase one, assuming that any problems that turn up in the 2007 model can be easily fixed. If I am disappointed in the new GTR then I guess I would need to look at alternative cars.
08-14-2005, 12:41 PM
#28
GTR Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 869
sure. i'd also take the TMS 2005 car with a grain of salt.
i believe as well, because there is so much expectation and heritage tied up in the entire GT-R program, Nissan is really going to ensure this car is immaculately presented, and is light years beyond the 350Z and others. it will be on an entirely different planet:
the Infiniti nameplate has its a$$ on the line: it is a hallmark of excellence and distinction. so the GT-R cannot have petty and stupid problems right out of the gate, as it will be laughed out of the showrooms. especially at the level it is competing (Porsche 996).
it is important to note that this car is not exactly being rushed to market. they're not just slapping it together. so overall i think the GT-R will be a solid car, albeit unaffordable to most. and its unattainability will enhance the mystique factor all over again.
as for me, i will have an R32 long before i ever have the 2008 GT-R. but i love knowing the GT-R will be "relevant" again, or, rather, kept current. if the latest incarnation-to-be of the GT-R follows anything resembling the re-emergence of the GT-R in 1989, the first few hundred Infinity GT-Rs will be homologated race cars. so keep that in mind when you are shopping --you're buying a race car. and you are a member of a great heritage.
i believe as well, because there is so much expectation and heritage tied up in the entire GT-R program, Nissan is really going to ensure this car is immaculately presented, and is light years beyond the 350Z and others. it will be on an entirely different planet:
the Infiniti nameplate has its a$$ on the line: it is a hallmark of excellence and distinction. so the GT-R cannot have petty and stupid problems right out of the gate, as it will be laughed out of the showrooms. especially at the level it is competing (Porsche 996).
it is important to note that this car is not exactly being rushed to market. they're not just slapping it together. so overall i think the GT-R will be a solid car, albeit unaffordable to most. and its unattainability will enhance the mystique factor all over again.
as for me, i will have an R32 long before i ever have the 2008 GT-R. but i love knowing the GT-R will be "relevant" again, or, rather, kept current. if the latest incarnation-to-be of the GT-R follows anything resembling the re-emergence of the GT-R in 1989, the first few hundred Infinity GT-Rs will be homologated race cars. so keep that in mind when you are shopping --you're buying a race car. and you are a member of a great heritage.
11-16-2005, 11:05 AM
#29
Newbie
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 3
I think the GTR should stay a Nissan. Who cares about the price range and what age group buys it?? Why bring it to market if it's not going to be fully enjoyed? Did Ford bring back the GT40 as a Lincoln? Did the Viper concept come to market as a Chrysler? Obviously Dodge didn't give a crap and say, hmmmm, maybe the $50,000 price tag back in 1992 or 1993, not sure when, would only be justified if it's a Chrysler. The Viper has been around, and is doing well, and guess what it's still a Dodge. The thing I don't get is why pay $10,000 to 20,000 for a name if your getting a less powerful version for the US market. For example the Toyota Soarer, it's twin turboed in Japan and it's a Toyota. It reaches these shores, and it's rebadged a Lexus SC300/SC400, with an NA crap engine, and your gonna pay how much more for the Lexus name. Hmmmm, let's see.... crappier, slower performance and a higher price tag. Yeah, that always rates high at the top of my Christmas wish list. 
Also, older people don't always have the more profitable jobs, with all the young actors and actresses and drug dealers(yes, sad to say, but had to throw them in for demographics) out there, they're also buying the fancy new cars. All in all, I'm just glad to have the Skyline GTR back in Nissans lineup, whether it be an Infiniti or Nissan. The Corvette needs to get *****slapped. At least we can count on Toyota bringing the new Supra back as a Toyota. 
Also, older people don't always have the more profitable jobs, with all the young actors and actresses and drug dealers(yes, sad to say, but had to throw them in for demographics) out there, they're also buying the fancy new cars. All in all, I'm just glad to have the Skyline GTR back in Nissans lineup, whether it be an Infiniti or Nissan. The Corvette needs to get *****slapped. At least we can count on Toyota bringing the new Supra back as a Toyota.
Last edited by Hayashi Drift; 11-16-2005 at 11:10 AM.
12-11-2005, 03:58 PM
#30
Newbie
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 5
Originally Posted by Hayashi Drift
I think the GTR should stay a Nissan.
True luxury-minded customers will probably find the GT-R to be very unrefined and unpolished for trips to the country club or weekend getaways (and probably buy a Porsche or Corvette instead). While most loyal Nissan customers won't be able to afford a 60-70K sports coupe.
Their true customer base wouldn't care whether the GT-R is badged an Infiniti or Nissan, and will only care about two things - performance & performance potential!
My biggest fear with this car is the evil dealer mark-up that will occur when the GT-R is first introduced. I plan on pre-ordering mine, but not if the dealer slaps on a 10-20K mark-up above MSRP.
Last edited by Chiketkd; 12-11-2005 at 04:00 PM.